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Ollyrules 23.04.2019 08:41 AM

The Official 2019 NFL draft discussion thread
 
Right similar to last year, here is the discussion thread for the few days pre draft talk (rumours), and then for us to talk during the draft itself!

Who is staying up? I will be up for both days one and two, can’t wait!

wayne ellis 23.04.2019 09:37 AM

Yep, never miss it! Going to be a long wait for the Jets’ second pick if we stay at #3 though...

BuffaloG 23.04.2019 10:00 AM

NFL Network on my phone, Espn on my laptop, unfollow a couple of journos on Twitter and stay off Twitter completely from about 30 mins before the Bills pick is my plan.

RichardCunliffe 23.04.2019 10:48 AM

I should be around, although I was wavering at one point. Problem is, it's not quite the same when it isn't Live. Plus I never trust that I'll be able to get the same coverage 'on demand' or when I want it.

I'm waiting for a little bit of doubt to creep in about Murray going at no.1. If Bosa went 1st it would be interesting to see the knock on effect. Quinnen Williams might be the best player in the Draft, but he's not the ideal pick for the 9ers or Jets. They've already got top 10 picks at DT, and they'll need paying soon too.

LesterHayes 23.04.2019 10:55 AM

I think that "little bit of doubt" is already there Richard. Some reports out there that the Cards are cooling. Prisco reporting that it was all a tactic to generate more season ticket buyers that fell flat on top of his low Wonderlic. Time will tell I guess.

RichardCunliffe 23.04.2019 10:58 AM

I'm in the camp that struggles to place Rashan Gary in this Draft. Lack of production and motor/work ethic questions leave a cloud over him that's hard to shake despite the athleticism.

Now Rapoport has said Gary's shoulder/labram was 'flagged' as a mild concern. Demarcus Lawrence played most of the past 2 seasons in need of labrum surgery, so it's not the end of the world.

It's another 'flag' though.

RichardCunliffe 23.04.2019 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesterHayes (Post 2397969)
I think that "little bit of doubt" is already there Richard. Some reports out there that the Cards are cooling. Prisco reporting that it was all a tactic to generate more season ticket buyers that fell flat on top of his low Wonderlic. Time will tell I guess.

Not sure whether the Cards deserve credit for keeping everyone guessing, but they are doing a good job of it considering how long the Murray circus has been going on.

So many opinions start to surface at this time of year its impossible to know what's going on (which is the way it should be).

It's like the Raiders 'surprise pick' talk.

Crash11 23.04.2019 11:54 AM

Won't be until Friday evening until I get to sit down and watch the first round so will be avoiding all things NFL until then

Now happy with my opinion that Murray will be a bust. Too many character red flags and whilst the game has evolved since the likes of Doug Flutie not many 5'9" QBs are likely to have a career a first overall warrants

LesterHayes 23.04.2019 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crash11 (Post 2397975)
Won't be until Friday evening until I get to sit down and watch the first round so will be avoiding all things NFL until then

Now happy with my opinion that Murray will be a bust. Too many character red flags and whilst the game has evolved since the likes of Doug Flutie not many 5'9" QBs are likely to have a career a first overall warrants

This, this and a hundred times this!

You don't make a number 1 pick in order to prove everyone wrong. Character seems suspect, Wonderlic on the very low side, measurables, at best, too small. Lighter and shorter than Wilson, who is the only player even remotely comparable and who is the only QB ever to be both under 6 feet tall and a Superbowl winner?

Seems nuts to me too.

goodkarma84 23.04.2019 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesterHayes (Post 2397977)
This, this and a hundred times this!

You don't make a number 1 pick in order to prove everyone wrong. Character seems suspect, Wonderlic on the very low side, measurables, at best, too small. Lighter and shorter than Wilson, who is the only player even remotely comparable and who is the only QB ever to be both under 6 feet tall and a Superbowl winner?

Seems nuts to me too.


wonderlic doesnt matter.



i like Murray a fair bit in the right system he will be a star.

where does the character concern come from?
i will focus on the play rather than the size.



as much as i'm a bit negative on the QBs most of them have things to like and it could turn out to be a good class but they also come with some doubts.

liam66 23.04.2019 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollyrules (Post 2397962)
Who is staying up? I will be up for both days one and two, can’t wait!

I'll be here throughout. Have always enjoyed following along with the forum during a draft and rather looking forward to it this year.

Preparing myself for the usual all-night wait for the Seahawks pick only for them to trade out of round one!

wayne ellis 23.04.2019 02:56 PM

Haskins to the Raiders at #4 seems to be doing the rounds. Can’t rule out anything at Draft time, but I’d be very surprised if this is anything more than a smokescreen.

iffies 23.04.2019 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wayne ellis (Post 2397985)
Haskins to the Raiders at #4 seems to be doing the rounds. Can’t rule out anything at Draft time, but I’d be very surprised if this is anything more than a smokescreen.

I could see us going QB at 4 if we were able to shift Carr for some picks. But to take Haskins to sit behind Carr for a year would be bonkers.

LesterHayes 23.04.2019 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodkarma84 (Post 2397983)
wonderlic doesnt matter.

We did this last year re. Lamar Jackson so I'm not going there again. :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodkarma84 (Post 2397983)
i like Murray a fair bit in the right system he will be a star.

A system with very short O-Lineman no doubt? ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodkarma84 (Post 2397983)
where does the character concern come from?

Well, I think most would agree he's been surly and uncommunicative in anything you can find online would they not?

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodkarma84 (Post 2397983)
i will focus on the play rather than the size.

You do that. Personally I find it hard to separate one from the other. My prediction is that he'll flame out, possibly due to injury but more likely because he's just too small. Super talented, no doubt, just too small.

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodkarma84 (Post 2397983)
as much as i'm a bit negative on the QBs most of them have things to like and it could turn out to be a good class but they also come with some doubts.

We agree on something! If I were a GM I'd be waiting on the 2020 class and I think Murray and everyone else, were they all in that class rather than this one would all be 2nd Round or lower.

LesterHayes 23.04.2019 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wayne ellis (Post 2397985)
Haskins to the Raiders at #4 seems to be doing the rounds. Can’t rule out anything at Draft time, but I’d be very surprised if this is anything more than a smokescreen.

I'm holding out on 2 things.

1. Gruden has never drafted a rookie QB.

2. Mike Mayock

goodkarma84 23.04.2019 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesterHayes (Post 2397989)
We did this last year re. Lamar Jackson so I'm not going there again. :D



A system with very short O-Lineman no doubt? ;)



Well, I think most would agree he's been surly and uncommunicative in anything you can find online would they not?



You do that. Personally I find it hard to separate one from the other. My prediction is that he'll flame out, possibly due to injury but more likely because he's just too small. Super talented, no doubt, just too small.



We agree on something! If I were a GM I'd be waiting on the 2020 class and I think Murray and everyone else, were they all in that class rather than this one would all be 2nd Round or lower.


we did :p


we are talking about an inch or 2 max from other successful fellas.


i havent watched interviews but not it doesnt seem like something to build character concerns on.



big players get injured too.

Latic 23.04.2019 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollyrules (Post 2397962)
Right similar to last year, here is the discussion thread for the few days pre draft talk (rumours), and then for us to talk during the draft itself!

Who is staying up? I will be up for both days one and two, can’t wait!

Nfl network on the telly, and Bleacher Report coverage on my laptop - plus tonnes of food. Nice long wait for the Colts pick this year too, so even more invested in each pick :D

wayne ellis 23.04.2019 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Latic (Post 2398000)
Nfl network on the telly, and Bleacher Report coverage on my laptop - plus tonnes of food. Nice long wait for the Colts pick this year too, so even more invested in each pick :D

Think Ballard will do well to match last year’s class!

LesterHayes 23.04.2019 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodkarma84 (Post 2397997)
we are talking about an inch or 2 max from other successful fellas.

And 10 - 20lbs of weight too don't forget.

I just can't get away from the stats: no QB under 6ft tall with the exception of Russell Wilson has won a Superbowl. How many QB's under 6ft have done anything in the last 25 years? 1?

Wilson was drafted in the 3rd Round for a reason. Interestingly one pundit at the time (it was Jon Gruden) said "the only issue with Russell Wilson is his height. That might be the reason he's not picked in the first couple rounds" and most evaluators, including those in Seattle lets not forget, had him pegged as a mid round 'maybe'. Murray should be seen through that prism IMO.

Latic 23.04.2019 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wayne ellis (Post 2398001)
Think Ballard will do well to match last year’s class!

#InBallardWeTrust

Gotta be confident with whoever we pick. Remember being a bit underwhelmed with the Darius Leonard pick given the draft hype of players still on the board...one all pro and DROY season later and here we are.

Ollyrules 23.04.2019 05:10 PM

Don’t get the Murray character concerns either - so he gave a poor interview on TV or two...it really doesn’t matter (and he was clearly being poorly advised at the time of the I think pro football talk interview? When they were clearly trying to make sure the baseball team didn’t want all his money back). There is nothing but praise and good things about him from his time with Oklahoma, and also, a baseball squad had no issue with his character to take him in the top 10 of their sporting draft last year....

Height - for me not an issue, he played with great huge hunking O-linemen at Oklahoma (quite a few of which will be drafted), and Murray is great at finding throwing lanes like a Drew Brees is.

His frame is a little concerning to me, he is a little slight - but he’s also only 21. Hardly finished developing, and because of the baseball stuff he wouldn’t have been trying to bulk up recently anyways.

I think what’s been overlooked throughout the process with Murray is just what an incredible thrower of the football he is. This isn’t a Lamar Jackson who clearly has accuracy and progression issues, this is a guy who sits in the pocket and can make all the throws, but if it’s clearly nothing on or not open, he can hit a home run on the ground too. For me he’s a better passer than Mayfield was this time last year

For me, you evaluate the player not some stats based on things from decades ago about smaller QBs. This is a different league to the 1990’s, heck even five-ten years ago, so I really do struggle to see what impact comparing to players who played them has

Ollyrules 23.04.2019 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by liam66 (Post 2397984)
I'll be here throughout. Have always enjoyed following along with the forum during a draft and rather looking forward to it this year.

Preparing myself for the usual all-night wait for the Seahawks pick only for them to trade out of round one!

With them only having 4 picks (iirc) throughout the draft, it’d be a surprise to me if they didn’t trade out of #21 and back a bit!

goodkarma84 23.04.2019 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesterHayes (Post 2398002)
And 10 - 20lbs of weight too don't forget.

I just can't get away from the stats: no QB under 6ft tall with the exception of Russell Wilson has won a Superbowl. How many QB's under 6ft have done anything in the last 25 years? 1?

Wilson was drafted in the 3rd Round for a reason. Interestingly one pundit at the time (it was Jon Gruden) said "the only issue with Russell Wilson is his height. That might be the reason he's not picked in the first couple rounds" and most evaluators, including those in Seattle lets not forget, had him pegged as a mid round 'maybe'. Murray should be seen through that prism IMO.


being unique isnt a bad thing, plenty of tall QBs get draft and really suck ;)


and how much of an issue has Wilsons height been?


Baker and Brees are both 6ft not that much taller.

Ollyrules 23.04.2019 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollyrules (Post 2398005)
With them only having 4 picks (iirc) throughout the draft, it’d be a surprise to me if they didn’t trade out of #21 and back a bit!

And as soon as I post this, Seattle has picked up pick #29 via the Frank Clark trade - might be worth staying up after all Liam!

RichardCunliffe 23.04.2019 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollyrules (Post 2398008)
And as soon as I post this, Seattle has picked up pick #29 via the Frank Clark trade - might be worth staying up after all Liam!

29 is a prime pick to trade back from too.

A 1st and 2nd rd pick, not a bad return for the 63rd pick in the 2015 Draft.

iffies 23.04.2019 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCunliffe (Post 2398010)
29 is a prime pick to trade back from too.

A 1st and 2nd rd pick, not a bad return for the 63rd pick in the 2015 Draft.

The second round pick is the one they got from the 49ers for Dee Ford, who wasn't really a fit as they are switching to a 4-3.

djhdjh 23.04.2019 06:08 PM

I think the Murray height issue does need to be considered. There are some throws where he clearly has to put the ball on a more up and down trajectory than taller QB's because of his height, so it clearly is a factor. Would those balls be more likely to get intercepted at the next level? Maybe. Does he have to move about sometimes because he can't get the lane? Certainly.

On the other hand he was a twice All-American in High School and a Heisman Trophy winner this past season. He has clearly worked out how to be very effective within those parameters. He's accurate in the pocket and on the move, has a fast release, can throw deep, can throw with velocity and is deadly with his legs. Does his height and build really outweigh all that?

He feels like the only QB in the draft who has much chance to be a high level guy in the league (while seeing Haskins as someone who can be an OK starter).

liam66 23.04.2019 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollyrules (Post 2398008)
And as soon as I post this, Seattle has picked up pick #29 via the Frank Clark trade - might be worth staying up after all Liam!

Nothing was going to stop me from doing this!

Am not surprised to hear this trade is going through. I thought we would make a deal involving Clark with someone this week. Exciting as it puts our focus even more heavily on the strong DE class.

RichardCunliffe 23.04.2019 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iffies (Post 2398014)
The second round pick is the one they got from the 49ers for Dee Ford, who wasn't really a fit as they are switching to a 4-3.

I read it was the Chiefs lower 2nd rd pick, so you'd expect that to be their own rather than the 49ers'.

$105m, $63.5m guaranteed. 5 years.

iffies 23.04.2019 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCunliffe (Post 2398019)
I read it was the Chiefs lower 2nd rd pick, so you'd expect that to be their own rather than the 49ers'.

$105m, $63.5m guaranteed. 5 years.

Still, seems a lot to give up for essentially a player swap.

RichardCunliffe 23.04.2019 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iffies (Post 2398020)
Still, seems a lot to give up for essentially a player swap.

The Chiefs want to win before they pay Mahomes. They're getting the best pass rusher they can for the 29th pick really.

Dee Ford didn't fit their 4-3. Clark is a better fit.

It has cost them to 'swap players', but it always does.

They are certainly a better team in 2019 than they were this morning, and more than likely better than they would've been if they selected a rookie at 29.

goodkarma84 24.04.2019 12:28 AM

a decent piece on the combine interviews

https://www.bbc.com/sport/american-football/47818230

RichardCunliffe 24.04.2019 10:12 AM

I was just playing around with 'predict the pick', and the thought occurred to me....

Would the Raiders take TJ Hockenson at 4?

They have a need.

It's Mayock's first ever pick as a GM. Could he see Hockenson as a 'can't miss' pick? A pick that he can 'hang his GM hat on'?

BuffaloG 24.04.2019 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCunliffe (Post 2398051)
I was just playing around with 'predict the pick', and the thought occurred to me....

Would the Raiders take TJ Hockenson at 4?

They have a need.

It's Mayock's first ever pick as a GM. Could he see Hockenson as a 'can't miss' pick? A pick that he can 'hang his GM hat on'?

My gut feeling is no. If they valued TE that much they would have kept Cook

RichardCunliffe 24.04.2019 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuffaloG (Post 2398052)
My gut feeling is no. If they valued TE that much they would have kept Cook

Maybe that's why they let Cook go? They knew they could get an upgrade?

BuffaloG 24.04.2019 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCunliffe (Post 2398053)
Maybe that's why they let Cook go? They knew they could get an upgrade?

Possibly. I think Irv Smith Jr would be more likely given they have 3 picks in his expected range.

I have a hard time believing the Raiders don't go best pass rusher available either Edge or Interior at 4

LesterHayes 24.04.2019 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCunliffe (Post 2398051)
I was just playing around with 'predict the pick', and the thought occurred to me....

Would the Raiders take TJ Hockenson at 4?

They have a need.

It's Mayock's first ever pick as a GM. Could he see Hockenson as a 'can't miss' pick? A pick that he can 'hang his GM hat on'?

You never know with us but I'm thinking no - he isn't the greatest Tight End ever and he'd have to be to go at #4.

RichardCunliffe 24.04.2019 11:47 AM

I see where people are coming from with TE. Is Josh Allen nailed on as a top 3 pick?

Crossing over from another thread too with Marshawn Lynch's retirement and the Josh Jacobs talk. I don't think Jacobs makes it to #24.

LesterHayes 24.04.2019 12:03 PM

I'm expecting us to move around the board a bit on the night. With 3 first rounders we have the capital to do it. Wouldn't surprise me a bit if we packaged 24 and/or 27 to move up for a player we really want.

goodkarma84 24.04.2019 11:18 PM

so the rumour is that the worst owner in the league (its so obvious i dont think it should take anyone more than 1 guess) has played the its mine team card and taken over the 1st round for his team.


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