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Old 25.09.2009, 01:58 PM
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Csonka#39 Csonka#39 is offline
Join Date: 06.10.2006
Posts: 21,249

Originally Posted by Secret Admirer View Post
My claims aren't impossible to back up. They're not particularly easy to demonstrate, but my knowledge comes from having worked in this field. When I tell you that ATOS are basically there to reject as many people as possible, you're just going to have to take my word for it. If you want to remain skeptical because I can't prove it, that's fine, but you certainly won't find anyone who claims anything different, particularly anyone who's had to have their medical or who has worked for them.

Here's a few more facts about IB
1) There are 1.4m people on it (not the 2.7m figure you will sometimes hear quoted, that's the total amount of people who have ever claimed it).
2) There's no short term incentive to go on it, it pays something like £2 more than the adult rate of JSA for the first year. After that it goes up to about £80 p/w, which is significantly less than a 35 hour p/w job at minimum wage.
3) 40% of people on it suffer from a mental health problem. And these tend to be severe, not the sort of thing where you an just take some pills and be fine.

The problem for a lot of people, isn't that they're permanently unable to do any sort of work, more precisely, IME, they tend to be able to do many things at one point, and very little at another. So for a few days, they might be great, up at 8am and out and able to do things, then for another week, just getting out of bed and going to the toilet is a significant challenge. Never mind cooking a proper meal, washing, carrying out every day errands like going to a bank etc. My experience of working with these people is that they would absolutely love to get a job, they feel that most able bodied people don't realise how lucky they are to be able to get one, but it just isn't going to happen if they're honest with potential employers - disabilities aren't really convenient enough to fit in to a nice shift pattern. Most jobs require you to be there, on time, every day, no excuses. Yeah you get a bit of leeway. But if you miss entire weeks because you just can't make it in, then who's going to take you?

Especially nowadays when even basic minimum wage jobs like supermarket work and high street shops have a 6 month probation period during which you can be let go for any reason.

Let's do the math. There are currently 450k job vacancies, and 2.5m people on JSA. Now in the last ten years there was a point when less than 1m people were on JSA, so of that 2.5m, we can assume that at least 1.5m are employable and would like to work. 1.5m into 450k? How do you do that? However, the 450k keeps getting smaller, the 2.5m keeps getting bigger, and you want to dump another 1m people on top of that?
I have a theory that the reason there are so few jobs is because Women now go to work rather than being home mothers to families. not being sexist here but it has to be a factor right. . not to mention the growth in population and all of us living longer. .wages are now not enough to cover the cost of living. if they ever were and with more and more career women the jobs for male workers shrinks. . higher unemployment with not enough jobs to fulfill the need.

Supermarkets etc only employing PT workers means someone has to now get 2 jobs rather than 1 in order to make ends meet. .

So a growing population with women workers and PT jobs all add up to us being stuffed for work. . not to mention the immigration issue where indiginous peoples are losing out to migrant workers. .

right Ive lit the paper now I sit back and watch the fireworks. .
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