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  #14831  
Old 24.12.2017, 09:54 PM
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Originally Posted by European Bob View Post
What has Iraq got to do with Brexit?
There are two similarities I can think of.

The first is the disastrous and unforgivable lack of analysis and preparation conducted by the Neo Cons for the occupation of Iraq. In that sense "invasion-lite" seems rather too much like the "red, white and blue brexit" we are getting. Details? Who needs details?

The second is the tendency for the British to lean on a "special relationship" that has long ceased to exist, even when this results in us falling flat on our faces. We got sucked into the Invasion of Iraq for no other reason than the Americans asked us to do it, and saying no would look bad. Brexiteers hold out hope that a lot of our trade can be somehow redirected to a friendly and accommodating USA. Which is idiotic, since it represents a basic failure to understand what trade is.

Incidentally, on the Invasion of Iraq, I'm going to put my hand up and confess that while I was not an enthusiastic backer of the war, I was not dead against it either. I didn't know a lot about it at the time really. Saddam was a brutal dictator and I think his sons, when his death beckoned, would have been far worse. Whether the war was the right or the wrong thing to do, it was certainly badly executed. If the coalition had gone in with a carefully laid plan for occupation, and 3/4 of a million troops to implement it, maybe it would have turned out differently. But that would have been a very inconvenient war for America (conscription, etc).
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  #14832  
Old 04.01.2018, 05:03 PM
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in a move best described as that of a crazy dictator, Trump is going to be giving out awards for fake news, to well whats likely to be real news.

also proving he has the mind of an actual child he tweeted that he has a bigger nuke button that NK, cos being Presidential is easy
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  #14833  
Old 04.01.2018, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by goodkarma84 View Post
in a move best described as that of a crazy dictator, Trump is going to be giving out awards for fake news, to well whats likely to be real news.

also proving he has the mind of an actual child he tweeted that he has a bigger nuke button that NK, cos being Presidential is easy
Also trying to silence a book that is mean about him.

Also trying to Smear a guy as a lunatic who we all knew was a lunatic when he first went to work for the Trump campaign
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  #14834  
Old 04.01.2018, 06:34 PM
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Also trying to silence a book that is mean about him.

Also trying to Smear a guy as a lunatic who we all knew was a lunatic when he first went to work for the Trump campaign
its more amazing every month to think this rag tag bunch of lunatics beat the amazing $1Bn+ Clinton machine and the MSM.haha.

also reports Bannon who all of a sudden is the most trusted "source" for a story now on CNN was under NDA when most of these events he talked about happened hence the book been stopped.

also missed in yesterdays news cycle is Paul Manafort lawyer challenging the "broad authority of special counsel Robert Mueller" in court.at some point a federal judge may be asked does the crime of "collusion" which doesn't actually exist in US law justify the fishing expedition that the DOJ/FBI have been on.
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  #14835  
Old 04.01.2018, 06:45 PM
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Wish Tony Blair would just foxtrot oscar. Man should be locked up as a war criminal, not given a platform to espouse his democracy subverting views on Brexit.
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  #14836  
Old 04.01.2018, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Corvus corax View Post
Wish Tony Blair would just foxtrot oscar. Man should be locked up as a war criminal, not given a platform to espouse his democracy subverting views on Brexit.
and lets not forget one day he will be sitting in the Lords with all the other ex-PM's having more un-elected influence.

not sure who Blair is appealing to over Brexit,cant imagine many current Corbyn followers care about what he says.
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  #14837  
Old 04.01.2018, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by lee harris 10 View Post
its more amazing every month to think this rag tag bunch of lunatics beat the amazing $1Bn+ Clinton machine and the MSM.haha.

also reports Bannon who all of a sudden is the most trusted "source" for a story now on CNN was under NDA when most of these events he talked about happened hence the book been stopped.

also missed in yesterdays news cycle is Paul Manafort lawyer challenging the "broad authority of special counsel Robert Mueller" in court.at some point a federal judge may be asked does the crime of "collusion" which doesn't actually exist in US law justify the fishing expedition that the DOJ/FBI have been on.

hardly amazing, that the dull sensible choice, who still got more actual votes, lost to a lowest common denominator bating candidate, whose campaign was 99.999% lies. the list of lies is too long and grows by the minute but lets quickly name say draining the swamp and that Trump healthcare plan

who you defend on any point but with nothing to back up why?

pretty sure he was charged with actual crimes.

and is that the fellas at Fox working you again?
they have tried to claim its a coup, funny for a few reasons.
then the old branding job, investigation and fishing expedition, just another case of the Affordable Care Act and Obamacare.
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  #14838  
Old 05.01.2018, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Corvus corax View Post
Wish Tony Blair would just foxtrot oscar. Man should be locked up as a war criminal, not given a platform to espouse his democracy subverting views on Brexit.
You know what really bothers Brexiteers about Blair?

He's totally right about it. And it's entirely possible for someone to be massively wrong on one thing (Iraq) whilst being totally right about another (Brexit).

He's no subverting democracy, democracy didn't end on June 23rd 2016, and any genuine democracy has the right to change its mind (David Davis famously said that once, I wonder if he remembers it). And there's also the whole thing about the referendum being non-binding - an act of parliament was required to push ahead with article 50 and an act of parliament can attempt to reverse course - regardless of what 'the will of the people' (ugh) is, was or will be. We don't live in a plebiscite, and long may that continues.

Blair can't be the remain camp figurehead, because people just throw 'war criminal' at him and refuse to listen (in the same way that people don't listen to Nick Clegg talking sense on brexit - they prefer to shout about tuition fees), but the tide is definitely turning. People are realising that they've been had by Vote leave, Leave.EU and the massively pro-brexit media barons.

Is it too late to stop Brexit? Possibly, but not definitely. And its certainly not too late to get article 50 extended, and it's not too late to sort out something around staying in the single market/customs union (as that is the only way of negotiating the Northern Irelend complexities.)

Last edited by HSTDriver; 05.01.2018 at 02:18 PM.
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  #14839  
Old 05.01.2018, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by lee harris 10 View Post
and lets not forget one day he will be sitting in the Lords with all the other ex-PM's having more un-elected influence.

not sure who Blair is appealing to over Brexit,cant imagine many current Corbyn followers care about what he says.
Corbyn needs to tread carefully. The vast majority of his party are remainers. I saw a figure the other day that had it around 80% of labour members are anti-brexit. I left the party over Corbyn's 3 line whip on article 50.

A lot of remainers (including myself) lent labour their vote in the GE to slap down Theresa May and her hardest of hard brexit ambitions. If Labour don't make concessions to the centrist/remainers, then their numbers will likely drop in the event of another GE.

The momentum crowd want to believe that Labour can't win power without them, when it's just as viable to say that Momentum can't seize power without the centrists.
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  #14840  
Old 06.01.2018, 06:17 PM
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Originally Posted by goodkarma84 View Post
hardly amazing, that the dull sensible choice, who still got more actual votes, lost to a lowest common denominator bating candidate, whose campaign was 99.999% lies. the list of lies is too long and grows by the minute but lets quickly name say draining the swamp and that Trump healthcare plan

who you defend on any point but with nothing to back up why?

pretty sure he was charged with actual crimes.

and is that the fellas at Fox working you again?
they have tried to claim its a coup, funny for a few reasons.
then the old branding job, investigation and fishing expedition, just another case of the Affordable Care Act and Obamacare.
nice to see this week some of the "never Trumpers" who spent all December on TV lying about the big Tax plan are now coming out and admitting it will help the average American as much as corporate America as promised.
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