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  #16371  
Old 27.05.2019, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lee harris 10 View Post
the conservatives campaigned on been the only party "that can deliver Brexit"

according to LibDems/Green/Change uk Labour is "a pro-Brexit party" so yet again how does there share not get added to the Leave at all cost parties to push that share to around 58% compared to the remain groups.

its all spin by the peoples vote to try and pretend they somehow won last night on a turnout of around 40%.

the remain groups still haven't got close to 100 seats in the commons compared to the massive numbers the two main parties hold if they can find a deal that allows them to move on and start getting there supporters back.

calling Labour pro-brexit is funny and is kinda whats wrong with anything.
Labour are willing to try and deliver a Labour brexit to honour the result but also willing to have a second vote. they are firmly on the fence and in this election no one wanting brexit would of voted for them, given how meaningless it was. more that likely they were made up by there mostly remain base.
the swings in votes show it.



the spin is that leave won, remain won but nothing has changed.



Quote:
Originally Posted by lee harris 10 View Post
remind me again what Labour's 2017 manifesto pledge was sure it was about "honouring" the referendum result and even with May's deal been defeated the Labour front bench have still stopped well short of backing a peoples vote and of course Alistair Campbell who has voted labour all his life said last night he voted LibDem because Labour is pro-Brexit.

also with the conservatives are committed to Leaving and anyone wanting to stand for the leadership will definetly kill there chances if they mention a 2nd vote rather than wanting to leave with some deal on 31st october so hard to not say there votes should be aligned with the LEAVE numbers.

and plenty has changed since 2017 and also see above on Labour.



no Tory would win on a second vote but at the same time they lack the margin to put anything through.



no deal, isnt getting votes in the house.
so for that to happen it would need a new GE and most likely need one to put any deal through.


however you want to boil it down, everything is still a mess.
the first vote offered no plan and the respecting the result, actually means a super soft brexit, given how close it was.

Leave and the whole respect democracy line is a nonsense.



so with the house so spilt and the people also spilt, the only logical way out is a deal vs remain second vote, that is cast iron.

if its remain the nightmare is over and we never have to hear that freaking word again.

if its leave, then the deal is already done and should have a set date when we leave.


we shouldnt of had a vote to start with but when we did it should of been that.



and if you are so sure people still want to Leave you will win.



then we have the GE, where its all about real issues and dealing with that result.
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  #16372  
Old 28.05.2019, 06:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lee harris 10 View Post
remind me again what Labour's 2017 manifesto pledge was sure it was about "honouring" the referendum result and even with May's deal been defeated the Labour front bench have still stopped well short of backing a peoples vote and of course Alistair Campbell who has voted labour all his life said last night he voted LibDem because Labour is pro-Brexit.

also with the conservatives are committed to Leaving and anyone wanting to stand for the leadership will definetly kill there chances if they mention a 2nd vote rather than wanting to leave with some deal on 31st october so hard to not say there votes should be aligned with the LEAVE numbers.
Remind me again whether you have to implement a manifesto pledge from an election you did not win.

I mean, this is so obvious.
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  #16373  
Old 28.05.2019, 03:26 PM
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An interesting weekend.

What surprised me the most was the 37% turnout? Wasn't this going to be the mother of all EU Parliamentary Elections? 2% more than the last one that most people didn't even know was happening and absolutely no one cared about anyway?

Truthfully, who cares who won this one? It's meaningless. Hardly anyone voted, 1 party actually stood on a 'we have no policy' ticket like something out of the Monster Raving Loony Party and 2 others had no manifesto and made no attempt to play at all. It also looks as though as many as 2 million people eligible to vote couldn't actually do it?

Never-the-less the other big surprise for me is the perpetuation of the pro Brexit narrative?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48417228

Remain parties (those clearly campaigning to stay in the EU) got 40% of the vote, those clearly advocating out got 35%? No doubt the BBC would publish this though right?

What a shambles. To top it all you then get Nigel Farage suggesting he now has a mandate to sit in on the Brexit talks!? Can you imagine??

Seriously, you could not make it up. Every time I think we've extended the idea of political farce about as far as is remotely possible, something else happens.

Last edited by LesterHayes; 28.05.2019 at 03:40 PM.
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  #16374  
Old 28.05.2019, 03:37 PM
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Kudos to Alastair Campbell for admitting to voting Lib Dem as they actually have a clear policy on Brexit, even though it has got him kicked out of the Labour Party.
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  #16375  
Old 28.05.2019, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesterHayes View Post
What a shambles. To top it all you then get Nigel Farage suggesting he now has a mandate to sit in on the Brexit talks!? Can you imagine??

Seriously, you could not make it up. Every time I think we've extended the idea of political farce about as far as is remotely possible, something else happens.



apart from showing there is support for a 2nd vote, the above is the main reason i care about the who won narrative.



he seems keen to make stuff up and try to get undue power and ignore reality.

his parties true motto should of been vote for a bunch of people that wont bother to show up, while making money.


also the turnout was pretty much as expected.
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  #16376  
Old 28.05.2019, 06:30 PM
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how is there "support" for a 2nd vote,think that 60% voted for parties NOT campaigning directly for another referendum so is somehow 40% more than 60% now......
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  #16377  
Old 28.05.2019, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iffies View Post
Kudos to Alastair Campbell for admitting to voting Lib Dem as they actually have a clear policy on Brexit, even though it has got him kicked out of the Labour Party.
sadly this just gives him even more air time.this guy did not care about the public voice when he was helping run this country but now is all for listening to the masses.
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  #16378  
Old 28.05.2019, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by European Bob View Post
Remind me again whether you have to implement a manifesto pledge from an election you did not win.

I mean, this is so obvious.
but the claims that somehow conservatives/Labour have not a stated opinion on Leaving the EU to somehow claim that Remain was the big winner on Sunday misses out those annoying facts they have both said they want to complete Brexit.

heck both parties just spent 6 weeks in talks trying to find a deal that would pass in the commons so yes they may not be no deal hard leave but they are still about Leaving.
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  #16379  
Old 28.05.2019, 06:50 PM
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lee harris 10 lee harris 10 is offline
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so the EHRC has officially launched an investigation into the Labour party over anti-Semitism so now join the BNP in 2010 as the only 2 parties they have investigated.

not a good list to be on for the official opposition party in our house of commons.
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  #16380  
Old 28.05.2019, 09:28 PM
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goodkarma84 goodkarma84 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lee harris 10 View Post
how is there "support" for a 2nd vote,think that 60% voted for parties NOT campaigning directly for another referendum so is somehow 40% more than 60% now.....

but the claims that somehow conservatives/Labour have not a stated opinion on Leaving the EU to somehow claim that Remain was the big winner on Sunday misses out those annoying facts they have both said they want to complete Brexit.

heck both parties just spent 6 weeks in talks trying to find a deal that would pass in the commons so yes they may not be no deal hard leave but they are still about Leaving.

Labour has said about taking the deal back to the people, to count them on the leave side is silly.



but hey if you are so confident and the same goes for Nigel, why not back a cast iron second vote, win and deliver it.



the will of the people doesnt matter anymore i guess
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