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  #11  
Old 09.04.2011, 05:44 PM
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Huntsman86 Huntsman86 is offline
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Originally Posted by erenmusXIX View Post
I do think its pretty close between Darreus vs Fairley but if we went DT with our 1st pick I would pick Darreus because of the impact he will make straight away, I think he would fit straight into the starting line up, not saying that Fairley wouldn't either but I think it would take more time, Fairley reminds me of Geno in the way he penetrates and I think in a rotation Darreus would be a better fit for the Bengals. Personally I think DE could be where we go because of Odom and Geathers not being fit and not being good basically.
Excellent point on DE, would you take Gabbert if he was there?
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  #12  
Old 09.04.2011, 06:45 PM
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DT-gate: Firstly, I'm sure Fairley will be a great player for someone else who gets him this year. That being said, there are far too many professional draftniks that have Darreus rated ahead of your boy and too many red flags on the guy for it to be a good value pick as you so called it. If anyone knows DTs its Warren Sapp and Sapp who thinks Darreus will be the better pro prospect, I can give you more people who think the same if you like? No doubt we need a young penetrating DT but not when there were a number of players available that fill other, more important needs, which takes me to QB...

Mallett is not as great as you make him sound, Why? well he's immature, he makes too many horrible throws (as well as great ones I agree) but he hates pressure in his face and has the mobility of a 55 year old...BG has proved during the process that he's going to be the best QB to come out of the draft and too many pro scouts and analysts say the same thing. How much of a good pick would it be to draft a quality young QB like Gabbert to re-ignite our flagging fanbase. 63% accuracy with only one real threat to throw to last year is not so bad and the spread offense is only as good as its support cast. The guys that make it work, have to work hard at it, Brady, Manning and Brees spring to mind and they have worked hard to get where they are, Gabbert has the same kind of hard working personality, not sure you could say the same thing about Mallett.

As much as you might love Moore, you cant give up 2 picks for him...he's not going to be a Troy or Ed type, which would be the only time you give up picks to get that guy.

You make decent points about your later picks but I haven't watched enough college games on your late round picks to make a comment, other than Marecic who looks a decent prospect. We have no depth at guard so not sure how you can say thats not an area of need? We will lose J-Joe unless he becomes a restricted free agent in a new CBA so you have to look to draft someone. We had too many injuries at CB last year to be confident in what we have.

As for Chad in NE, keep on dreaming...Bill likes Chad the person but when did BB welcome a distraction in his team?! BB is all about the Team and no doubt likes what he has...also I dont really want to get into this subject again as I know your stance on 85.

Look forward to your response.
I understand that a lot of guys have Dareus ahead of Fairley, and I can see why. However, I like to go on my personal opinions, rather than what I hear. From what I see, Fairley is going to be the better player. I may end up being wrong in that, and I don't profess to knowing more than Warren Sapp, Todd McShay or Mike Mayock, but if I based the way I drafted on their opinions I may as well not bother drafting. It's always nice when my opinions match those of experts, but when they don't I won't change mine too much, as I feel that I should do these things based on what I know and believe, and then live or die by that. If I'm wrong then fine, but I'd rather be wrong on what I think than be wrong because I've posted what someone else thinks.

Mallett certainly has bad points- the main one being his lack of mobility, which is a problem. However, he has a great arm, and with some good coaching he could become a star quarterback. Peyton Manning was never the most mobile, but he can step up or to one side to avoid pressure, and that can be taught. Mallett will never be Mike Vick, or even Manning in that regard, but he can work on it and make it less of an issue. His character is a problem, but he has first round ability, and I think we take the chance with him, and would be okay with that.

I don't think you can say for sure that Gabbert has proved he WILL be the best QB in this class. He has proved that he should be a good quarterback at the next level, but his college career was still not great. His offense was based on a lot of short throws, a lot of screen passes, and a lot of throws which he should complete. To illustrate the point, Blaine Gabbert's career completion percentage at Missouri was 63%. The quarterback there before him, Chase Daniel (currently a low-end number two in New Orleans) completed just shy of 68% of his passes at Missouri. That's not to say he was better than Gabbert, but it is to say that the system should make Gabbert's completion percentage a lot higher than it was, and the fact that it was not is a red flag.

Fair point with Moore, but if I had the chance I'd still make the trade. Considering the value with the later picks, I think it does a good job. It gives us a guy who can come in and start straight away at position where we have a huge need. He is the best safety in the draft by some way imo, and I'd have taken him at 35 if Mallett had not been there.

With J-Jo, I don't know that we will lose him. He has come out and said before that he wants to stay in Cincinnati, so he may go and test the market before coming back. Mike Brown has been known to reward his own- Palmer and Ochocinco both come to mid- and he will be keen to retain J-Jo. He may be gone, but I like what we have there, and would possibly look to an undrafted free agent or a low end veteran for depth, but I don't think we need more than that.

Guard is the same, we have a small need, but I wouldn't be addressing it in this draft yet. Guard is a position where we can pick up an undrafted guy or two to come into camp, and there are veterans we can bring in to compete for roster spots too.

Without going back into the Chad issue, BB was happy to sign Randy Moss, who has been much more of a problem than Chad. He has praised Chad many times, and I fully expect him to head there at the end of 2011.
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  #13  
Old 09.04.2011, 06:53 PM
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I've had Dareus over Fairley since watching their Bowl games (see my wish list below posted on 10th Feb).However, I think Fairley could be excellent and would take him at 4 (if we are not going to trade down,which we should do but won't).We definitely can't trade away picks, although I do like Rahim Moore(and he fits a need).The trouble with taking a QB 1st round is that CP9 is still on the books.He 'could' still turn up for work-unlikely,but nevertheless I still think BG is a bit of a reach at 4.
My view hasn't changed much since 10/2 except we'll obviously have to take QB in 2nd round instead of OL.
1. Maarcel Dareus DT
2. Stefan Wisniewski C/G
3. Pernell McPhee DE
4. Robert Sands FS
5. Kelvin Sheppard ILB
6. John Clay RB
7. Justin Boren OG
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  #14  
Old 09.04.2011, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by bengalblueboy1 View Post
I've had Dareus over Fairley since watching their Bowl games (see my wish list below posted on 10th Feb).However, I think Fairley could be excellent and would take him at 4 (if we are not going to trade down,which we should do but won't).We definitely can't trade away picks, although I do like Rahim Moore(and he fits a need).The trouble with taking a QB 1st round is that CP9 is still on the books.He 'could' still turn up for work-unlikely,but nevertheless I still think BG is a bit of a reach at 4.
My view hasn't changed much since 10/2 except we'll obviously have to take QB in 2nd round instead of OL.
1. Maarcel Dareus DT
2. Stefan Wisniewski C/G
3. Pernell McPhee DE
4. Robert Sands FS
5. Kelvin Sheppard ILB
6. John Clay RB
7. Justin Boren OG
Wisniewski is interesting there. I like him as a prospect, but I don't think he gives us any value there, as we don't have a big enough need to take him.

Not taking a QB at all is a massive gamble. It means we either need CP9 to come back, to overpay for a free agent like Bulger, or to overpay for a guy like Kolb, or even to risk a guy like Flynn. I think we have to have the insurance policy of a Locker/Mallett/Ponder in the second round.
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  #15  
Old 09.04.2011, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by mde203 View Post
I understand that a lot of guys have Dareus ahead of Fairley, and I can see why. However, I like to go on my personal opinions, rather than what I hear. From what I see, Fairley is going to be the better player. I may end up being wrong in that, and I don't profess to knowing more than Warren Sapp, Todd McShay or Mike Mayock, but if I based the way I drafted on their opinions I may as well not bother drafting. It's always nice when my opinions match those of experts, but when they don't I won't change mine too much, as I feel that I should do these things based on what I know and believe, and then live or die by that. If I'm wrong then fine, but I'd rather be wrong on what I think than be wrong because I've posted what someone else thinks.

Mallett certainly has bad points- the main one being his lack of mobility, which is a problem. However, he has a great arm, and with some good coaching he could become a star quarterback. Peyton Manning was never the most mobile, but he can step up or to one side to avoid pressure, and that can be taught. Mallett will never be Mike Vick, or even Manning in that regard, but he can work on it and make it less of an issue. His character is a problem, but he has first round ability, and I think we take the chance with him, and would be okay with that.

I don't think you can say for sure that Gabbert has proved he WILL be the best QB in this class. He has proved that he should be a good quarterback at the next level, but his college career was still not great. His offense was based on a lot of short throws, a lot of screen passes, and a lot of throws which he should complete. To illustrate the point, Blaine Gabbert's career completion percentage at Missouri was 63%. The quarterback there before him, Chase Daniel (currently a low-end number two in New Orleans) completed just shy of 68% of his passes at Missouri. That's not to say he was better than Gabbert, but it is to say that the system should make Gabbert's completion percentage a lot higher than it was, and the fact that it was not is a red flag.

Fair point with Moore, but if I had the chance I'd still make the trade. Considering the value with the later picks, I think it does a good job. It gives us a guy who can come in and start straight away at position where we have a huge need. He is the best safety in the draft by some way imo, and I'd have taken him at 35 if Mallett had not been there.

With J-Jo, I don't know that we will lose him. He has come out and said before that he wants to stay in Cincinnati, so he may go and test the market before coming back. Mike Brown has been known to reward his own- Palmer and Ochocinco both come to mid- and he will be keen to retain J-Jo. He may be gone, but I like what we have there, and would possibly look to an undrafted free agent or a low end veteran for depth, but I don't think we need more than that.

Guard is the same, we have a small need, but I wouldn't be addressing it in this draft yet. Guard is a position where we can pick up an undrafted guy or two to come into camp, and there are veterans we can bring in to compete for roster spots too.

Without going back into the Chad issue, BB was happy to sign Randy Moss, who has been much more of a problem than Chad. He has praised Chad many times, and I fully expect him to head there at the end of 2011.
The point you make in your first paragraph is commendable if nothing else. You were however representing the Bengals ina forum mock draft and should have done what was best for the team and not what made you feel good. Thats what I will be doing when I do the superfans mock draft on Football Today as the Bengals fan. On Gabbert, you see (through so much content on the web and games I have seen on him on ESPN America) a work ethic and talent similar those who have had success such as Ryan, Flacco, Bradford and Sanchez and when you look at Mallett you just cant help but think he's the next JaMarcus Russell.

Thanks for doing the mock draft and showing me the options out there but I wont be following your direction on any pick except maybe your boy Winterswyk from Boise State and looks like he would do his best to be a decent pro if he gets a chance.
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  #16  
Old 09.04.2011, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Huntsman86 View Post
The point you make in your first paragraph is commendable if nothing else. You were however representing the Bengals ina forum mock draft and should have done what was best for the team and not what made you feel good. Thats what I will be doing when I do the superfans mock draft on Football Today as the Bengals fan. On Gabbert, you see (through so much content on the web and games I have seen on him on ESPN America) a work ethic and talent similar those who have had success such as Ryan, Flacco, Bradford and Sanchez and when you look at Mallett you just cant help but think he's the next JaMarcus Russell.

Thanks for doing the mock draft and showing me the options out there but I wont be following your direction on any pick except maybe your boy Winterswyk from Boise State and looks like he would do his best to be a decent pro if he gets a chance.
The mock draft was done with how you would draft if you were the team's GM. That's what I would go with if I was called tomorrow by Mike Brown to take charge of our draft...... 'Cos that's gonna happen....

Best of luck with the Super Mock Draft, although I think it's only one round. It certainly was last year. Fair play not to go with my picks, it's your opinion, so go with that.
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  #17  
Old 09.04.2011, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by mde203 View Post
The mock draft was done with how you would draft if you were the team's GM. That's what I would go with if I was called tomorrow by Mike Brown to take charge of our draft...... 'Cos that's gonna happen....

Best of luck with the Super Mock Draft, although I think it's only one round. It certainly was last year. Fair play not to go with my picks, it's your opinion, so go with that.
Yep just the one round I think...not sure there was one last year but it definitely was the year before. I'm going Gabbert if he's there at 4.

From your picks it felt like Mike Brown was in charge anyway so you're not far off, haha!
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  #18  
Old 09.04.2011, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Huntsman86 View Post
Yep just the one round I think...not sure there was one last year but it definitely was the year before. I'm going Gabbert if he's there at 4.

From your picks it felt like Mike Brown was in charge anyway so you're not far off, haha!
Yeah there was one last year. Fair play with Gabbert, if he's your guy then grab him. I'm probably a little too low on him tbh, although I think there are definitely 10 better players than him in the draft.
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  #19  
Old 09.04.2011, 07:54 PM
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Yeah there was one last year. Fair play with Gabbert, if he's your guy then grab him. I'm probably a little too low on him tbh, although I think there are definitely 10 better players than him in the draft.
Then tell me who they are and we'll see...
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  #20  
Old 09.04.2011, 07:59 PM
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We can't not take a QB in this draft. But we can pass in Round 1 unless they are totally besotted with Gabbert or Newton. I dont like the Mallett pick, I just can't see how he fits the system. Locker might be ok, it's hard to understand how he can be so accurate outside the pocket but not in it. And besides, our OL will have him running all over the pitch so he'll do great!
Ponder might also be worth the risk. If we pass on QB take the best DL man - it would be Darreus for me - you gotta agree with QBkiller.

I think we could address Safety in Free Agency, the draft just seems so weak on them unless someone falls nicely into our laps. Weddle, Mikkell and Hough are all good enough, and we do tend to make 1 big money signing each off-season so it could be one of them. It's a risk though, not taking one in the draft as no one knows what happens in Free Agency.

Personally, I'd be looking to trade pick 4 to Houston ahead of SF. They must be slavering over PP, and I can't PP him going before us despite his talent. Go DL at 11 (probably Quinn), Locker at 36, and then hopefully we'd have Houston's 43rd so could take a CB because even if JJ doesn't go, then Hall might. We need a body.

I'd happily take a WR in round 2 as well. There's gonna be a ton, and maybe even at the top of round 3.

I wouldn't take a Guard. Fat Andre can play there, but I fear what weight he's gonna come in at with no pre-season.
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