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  #4941  
Old 16.12.2017, 08:36 AM
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If it helps Froome, then surely it's 'performance enhancing' in his case? Without it he can't perform at the same level.

Froome says he took Salbutamol (a common asthma drug) on the advice of his doctors, and within legal limits, but apparently it's a complex issue whereby many factors can affect the levels found in the body during testing. I can understand that, but he says he's been taking it for 10 years - how come this variety of factors has never conspired to produce a 'positive' test before?

Perhaps it's a storm in a tea cup, probably is. Funny that this comes to light the year he won the Tour and the Vuelta, and is aiming to take the Giro too. Someone out there hoping to derail that???
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  #4942  
Old 16.12.2017, 11:21 AM
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Well apparently he was notified in late September so well before he said he would do the Giro so I don’t think you can say anyone was trying to derail that. It just wasn’t made public until now. You are allowed to take this asthma drug if you notify the UCI about it, which Froome did and always has done. So do other riders too. It’s just the amount you can take. And apparently the urine sample suggests he took too much. I don’t know enough about these things to know if taking too much actually is of any benefit or whether it’s just like vitamin C and your body can only take a certain amount per day and then just gets rid of any excess. What I did find interesting was that Nibali, who also has asthma, said that in the final days of the Vuelta (which he also rode) it was not necessary for him to use the inhaler because there was wet weather, and the dampness reduces the impact of the pollen and so it’s not so hard to breathe. its the warm dry weather that does it. I don’t know what that means in terms of Froome though. As i say, it doesn’t seem like a particularly smart way to cheat when you know they test for it, tests pick it up and you as race leader will get tested. Doesn’t make sense.
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  #4943  
Old 16.12.2017, 11:50 AM
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Valid point on the timing and the Giro.

Good way of looking at it in terms of Vitamin C, hadn't thought of it like that. I just presumed it relaxed/reduced the inflammation in his lungs, effectively restoring them to 'natural' levels.

I don't understand it fully, but my issue is this. In very simple terms and this applies to all asthmatic athletes not just Froome. If Froome's lungs function at say 80% when effected by asthma. But with Salbutamol he's at 100%, then it's obviously beneficial to him. What if a 'healthy' athlete functions at 94% with no obvious signs of asthma. He wouldn't think to take Salbutamol but he could be missing out on a 5-6% improvement to his air ways/lung capacity. Obviously anyone is free to take it I presume, within legal limits, if they don't that's their choice. Still, even if it's only a 1% improvement it can make the difference.

Regarding Nibali, I'm guessing the effects vary from one person to the next.

Last edited by RichardCunliffe; 16.12.2017 at 12:18 PM.
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  #4944  
Old 16.12.2017, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by RichardCunliffe View Post
Valid point on the timing and the Giro.

Good way of looking at it in terms of Vitamin C, hadn't thought of it like that. I just presumed it relaxed/reduced the inflammation in his lungs, effectively restoring them to 'natural' levels.

I don't understand it fully, but my issue is this. In very simple terms and this applies to all asthmatic athletes not just Froome. If Froome's lungs function at say 80% when effected by asthma. But with Salbutamol he's at 100%, then it's obviously beneficial to him. What if a 'healthy' athlete functions at 94% with no obvious signs of asthma. He wouldn't think to take Salbutamol but he could be missing out on a 5-6% improvement to his air ways/lung capacity. Obviously anyone is free to take it I presume, within legal limits, if they don't that's their choice. Still, even if it's only a 1% improvement it can make the difference.

Regarding Nibali, I'm guessing the effects vary from one person to the next.
This is why some athletes totally refuse all TUEs. Tim Wellens I think it was went home from the Tour when he got ill rather than apply for permission to be given an otherwise banned substance to get better. It's a very grey issue though, isn't it. To put it in mechanical terms, is it akin to saying that if you get a puncture you need to carry on with a flat tyre and cannot fix it? It is very hard to know what the right answer is to this issue. But I don't think anyone would expect riders to have to carry on with equipment that didn't work.
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  #4945  
Old 16.12.2017, 05:56 PM
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Yeah I don't think it was done maliciously or to gain an unfair advantage, looks more like an amateurish mistake, possibly something as daft as forgetting he had taken a previous dose (seems odd that he measured double the allowed dosage) and you would think a professional organisation like Sky would be on top of that kind of thing.
surely if Froome has this ongoing "medical issue" then this isn't the 1st time he has needed to use an inhaler so think saying he maybe forgot something is a very weak excuse.the team doctor was also involved in the decision so he would surely have asked when/if Froome recently self-medicated.

two riders have been suspended 9 months/12 months for having excessive salbutamol in there systems but both with less than the double Froome failed for.

wonder if Froome may pay the price over sky's jiffy bag to Wiggins a few years back,maybe the rest of cycling will expect punishment even with Froome passing every other test during the race.
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  #4946  
Old 16.12.2017, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by lee harris 10 View Post
surely if Froome has this ongoing "medical issue" then this isn't the 1st time he has needed to use an inhaler so think saying he maybe forgot something is a very weak excuse.the team doctor was also involved in the decision so he would surely have asked when/if Froome recently self-medicated.

two riders have been suspended 9 months/12 months for having excessive salbutamol in there systems but both with less than the double Froome failed for.

wonder if Froome may pay the price over sky's jiffy bag to Wiggins a few years back,maybe the rest of cycling will expect punishment even with Froome passing every other test during the race.
Froome has used the inhaler before quite often, I think. He certainly had TUEs in the past, a few noted in 2013, 2014 during build up races.

It is quite hard to reconcile the two cases you reference for the other riders as the bans didn't make any logical sense by reference to the volumes of the banned substance. The only thing to say is that it was a different era, and different national federations issuing the bans (in fact I think one ban was issued by CAS on appeal).

I don't think this has anything to do with Wiggins at all. More likely is that the punishment will come from UKAD, I think. And my own opinion on this is that British media coverage of doping cases is quite intense and people seem to get much more angry about it than in some other countries. Hence this has come up for discussion on a forum like this, but when it comes to actual racing that isn't the Tour de France nobody much is interested.

One thing I will say without hesitation: the NFL has an infinitely greater problem with PEDs than cycling does in 2017. Yet when it happens in cycling it is front page news of newspapers (whereas the sport itself would never make the front page normally in the UK) whereas in the NFL it is just another story and quickly forgotten.
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  #4947  
Old 14.01.2018, 02:21 PM
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Has anyone set up a Road cc fantasy league this season? I didn't renew my subscription last year and wondered if the old league was still running.
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  #4948  
Old 05.03.2018, 03:38 PM
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So much for "100% clean racing" Team Sky...
www.bbc.co.uk/sport/43281807
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  #4949  
Old 05.03.2018, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by iffies View Post
So much for "100% clean racing" Team Sky...
www.bbc.co.uk/sport/43281807
Obviously no one knows what really went on, and anyone who does is probably already tainted by this one way or another.

Personally, it clearly supports the thought that athletes/organisations will 'bend the rules' to gain an advantage. Not only do they have a competitive nature that leads them to that, but it's also big business these days. Money matters. Given cycling's past it also comes as mo suprise, a team looking find an 'edge'.

When the 'corruption' goes so high it's easier to hide too.

The last thing I'd say, if this was Russia or the US we'd be all over it, ' cheating so and so's'. When it's on our own doorstep we kind of turn a blind eye to it.
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  #4950  
Old 05.03.2018, 06:22 PM
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The last thing I'd say, if this was Russia or the US we'd be all over it, ' cheating so and so's'. When it's on our own doorstep we kind of turn a blind eye to it.
I dont agree blind eyes have been given to this. The Guardian has been investigating doping and Sky for some time now and we have had Parliamentary committees and reports slamming the team - the UK holds itself to account pretty well in my opinion in matters such as these
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